This particular post has been prompted by the following comment posted on my blog by someone calling themselves ‘A Slacker’ (Read it here). They are unhappy at what they feel is censorship in another blog also accessed under the auspices of the Exc-el.org portal run by our Education division.
I don’t really want to go into the rights and wrongs of blog owners deleting comments posted against their entries other than to give my opinion. If you allow people to comment on your posts (as Exc-el.org encourages its contributors to do) then unless the posting is rude, offensive, derogatory or way off topic then I don’t think it should be deleted.
What I really want to comment on though is the idea of the post being deleted because it came from an anonymous contributor. This seems to me to be an utterly ludicrous argument as from what I have seen (and please feel free to correct me here as I might be missing something very obvious) anyone can post comments to my blog and claim to be anyone they want to be. I assume this holds true for other peoples blogs as well.
To post a comment on my blog all you need do is supply a name, an email address and hey presto you are suddenly Genghis Khan contributing your views on all matters ICT in East Lothian Schools. I’m not even sure old Genghis actually needs a valid email address but given how easy it would be for him to get one anyway this is a bit of an irrelevance.
Now whether Genghis would actually be able to contribute meaningfully to any ICT debate is in itself debatable but I’m sure he would have had an interesting slant on allowing teachers to install software.
My point is why should Genghis’ contribution be deleted just because I don’t know who he is. As my blog is available to the World via the Internet the reality is that many of the people reading my blog won’t know who the contributors actually are either (no matter whether they use an alias or even their real name)– does this make their contribution any less valid?
I choose to use Alan C as I’m too boring to think up something more original but think how interesting things could get (in our community at least) if I chose to use something like Alan Blackie or R Jones!
746 responses so far ↓
1
Ewan McIntosh
// Oct 27, 2006 at 5:04 pm
But often anonymous commenters are rude and are ’shouting’ - not reading things carefully enough or not taking into account the conversation. There’s nothing room with using a pseudonym, but it is better to be able to look at the (possibly anonymous) blog of the person to get to know them better, understand where they are coming from. You’re right that we shouldn’t delete comments just because they don’t agree with us. If you want to do that wherefor the blog?
2
Robert Jones
// Oct 29, 2006 at 3:22 pm
I’m not at all sure about the right thing to do.
It is important to understand the context in which I removed the anonymous comment. It was on a thread in which “A Slacker” had already posted a sarcastic snipe, and another anonymous poster had been aggressive and pushy in tone. I had made it clear that I was not going to accept any more anonymous comments.
In this context, why would “A Slacker” post another anonymous comment? Do you think that this was a constructive and sensible thing for him/her to do Alan? Did he/she imagine that I would capitulate and allow an anonymous comment to stand? Surely not - teachers generally mean what they say! It seems to me that to post another anonymous comment was, to say the least, disrespectful, and a challenge to my right to determine what does and does not appear on my blog.
Notwithstanding the above, however, I do not feel comfortable about deleting comments. I very much hope that I will not have to do it again.
The other aspect of this saga that merits discussion is why “A Slacker” felt unable or unwilling to unmask.
You are right that our conversations rely on trust about identity. This may well become an issue as blogging grows in popularity . The technology to identify oneself already exists, using PGP keys to sign messages - perhaps this should be incorporated into blogging software (if it hasn’t been already!).
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Ewan McIntosh
// Oct 29, 2006 at 3:29 pm
That is the big difference between a blog and a forum - the blog belongs to that individual and it is their ‘living room’. In a forum it’s an institution who moderates the content. I believe wholeheartedly that removing a comment must have been a difficult decision. I don’t mind snarky comments too much on my own blog provided the snark becomes useful constructive criticism. If someone is going to graffiti my space, though, that’s a different matter.
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Robert Jones
// Oct 29, 2006 at 9:17 pm
I’ve been away and done a bit of research into the whole issue of Web identity. Several alternatives already exist - PGP plugins for several blog platforms and OpenID. I am sure that we will be coming back to this as a community at some point.
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Alan Cruickshank
// Oct 30, 2006 at 11:29 am
Thanks for your comments guys. I do agree with you and give my own personal opinion in the post which is “If you allow people to comment on your posts (as Exc-el.org encourages its contributors to do) then unless the posting is rude, offensive, derogatory or way off topic then I don’t think it should be deleted.”
However from what I can see ‘A Slackers’ comment (assuming it was the same as was posted to my blog) was deleted simply because the blog owner doesnt personally know ‘A Slacker’. To my way of thinking the points made in the post in question were actually very valid to the topic and in no way could be construed as disrespectful or rude. Would it have been deleted if it had been posted with a name, say Fred? There are quite a few people who have posted comments on that particular topic that I have no idea who they are - does that make their views any less valid? I personally don’t think so.
This is what makes the deletion smack of censorship which is unfortunate as it appears a lot of people have been following the debate and some may now be put off contributing. Also as the blog is under the auspices of Exc-el.org I feel it sets a dangerous precident that could tarnish the way the portal is viewed.
I can think of a good many reasons why someone might feel they have a valid point to make but want to keep their identity private. For example, what if the person in question was actually a close colleague of the blog owner?
As to whether we need to authenticate users before they post comments - at this point I dont think so. At this point in time I think this would only be necessary if we wanted to restrict the audience or if we were being hit by such a number of non acceptable posts that it was putting people off keeping blogs or contributing to them.
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ewan mcintosh
// Oct 30, 2006 at 11:40 am
I think that’s the best way to handle things. If I feel someone is rude I tend to leave it up there and respond with the higher ground. But sometimes, too, it’s hard to know if an apparently irrelevant comment will gain relevance over time. yet another reason to not change posts or comments after the event.
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Robert Jones
// Oct 30, 2006 at 2:01 pm
As I’ve said many times before Alan, I’m finding my feet here, and have greatly appreciated the support I have received from Ewan and others.
I agree with you that it would be a shame to restrict debate, but also feel that it is important to be able to blog without fear of harassment in comments.
I did not remove the comment because I don’t “personally know ‘A Slacker’.” I removed the comment because I had made it clear that I was not going to allow anonymous commenting, and “A Slacker” ignored this and continued to post anonymously anyway. I think the fact that the comment in question was innocuous simply emphasises the fact that its removal was a matter of blog policy rather than victimisation of “A Slacker.”
Every other poster has provided a valid email address and most have given a Web site.
Given that you are a colleague of mine and given the overall content of the comments on my original post, I must say that I’m a little disappointed that you are judging my response to a difficult situation without passing any comment on “A Slacker” and particularly “Hard up Boy”, who after all caused this whole situation by their inappropriate commenting.
Given that they are speaking from your side of the fence that we are trying to break down, it does rather come across that this is a case of IT professionals sticking together. I’m sure that this is not the case, Alan, but as you say about the actions I’ve taken on my blog, it’s all about perceptions.
8
alancruickshank
// Oct 30, 2006 at 6:17 pm
Hi Robert, thanks for your comment. You are right, it is all about perceptions.
‘A Slacker’ came to my attention because they posted their comment on my blog and when I re-read the discussion taking place on yours I could see why they perceive their comments were censored. This in turn got me thinking about how we know who anyone is that contributes comments to our blogs and whether this was a bad thing or not. Hence my post. End of Story.
I’m sorry you feel my failure to comment on the actions of ‘Hard Up Boy’ and ‘A Slacker’ shows a lack of support for you. I haven’t commented simply because I really don’t have anything to say, as what they have or have not done in the context of your blog is not relevant to the point I was trying to explore.
Sorry if I’ve offended you as nothing I’ve said was intended to be personal and I apologise if you’ve perceived it to be.
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Robert Jones
// Oct 31, 2006 at 12:00 am
Thanks for the apology Alan - no offence taken
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Don
// Oct 31, 2006 at 12:01 am
I think you hit the nail on the head Robert when you said we are all finding our feet here. I’m sure we will have sorted out many of these issues by this time next year - it will just require a little patience - from all of us.
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Genghis Can't
// Oct 31, 2006 at 10:20 am
So ‘Robert Jones’ (if that’s your real name), your angle is that “you’re with me or against me”? That seems to be the theme from your 2.01pm post to Alan Cruickshank. I don’t think that because Alan is a ‘colleague’ that he HAS to comment on all your musings or support you on everything you say. Indeed, I thought the original stramash was caused by YOUR ‘inappropriate commenting’ which made some people think you were criticising your IT support service on the internet.
I think the lesson that really needs learning here is that if you have an in-house issue, try and deal with it in-house. If I have an issue in my workplace there are procedures to follow in order to try and solve the problem - commenting directly onto a website/blog/whatever with your problems surely only serves to get people’s backs up (and create ‘us vs them’ situation)?
And no, I’m a coward/whatever, I wish to remain anonyomous (you’ll have to take my word that I’m not A Slacker etc), and I think maybe you would want to think twice about publicising a link for your own personal blog on exc-el etc if you are worried about controlling people posting to it.
Peace.
12
Robert Jones
// Oct 31, 2006 at 6:05 pm
It wasn’t my intention to come over all George Bush here Mr Can’t (or may I call you Genghis?). Fair point about my initial comments. The difference between myself and the anonymous commenters is that I apologised immediately for my inappropriate comments and hoped that we could move on. I don’t suppose there’s so much incentive to apologise if you are commenting anonymously.
You may well be right about in-house issues. I guess I was trying to explore this in my “does anyone blog the bad stuff on a work blog” post. It would certainly reduce conflict
But it would also reduce communication. I’m not sure where the right balance lies - I don’t seem to be sure about anything these days!
Just for the record, reading back through the comments will confirm that I have never accused anonymous commenters of being cowards. I don’t think anyone has have they?
I really don’t want to control people posting comments on my blog - just to maintain some vague sense of decorum. Every blogger controls the comments on their blogs - even if it’s just to remove spam.
It feels rather surreal to me that I’m discussing the issue of control with IT support professionals and that I seem to be on the side of greater control. How the heck did that happen!?! I thought I was the Open Source developer of the side of freedom! I think I may have to scurry back to my blog and come up with a new commenting policy that celebrates freedom. In fact I think I’ll have some freedom fries for tea to celebrate
I wonder what other peoples’ experiences have been? Have others in the edublog field wrestled with this issue, or am I the only one stirring up trouble?
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